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Discussing the new Compressed DNG RAW Files

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  • Sfernald
    replied
    Huh? This is going to be nothing like RED compression.

    This is light lossless compression, Huffman, one of the most basic compression algorithms around. Think zipping a file, not creating a tiny jpg from a huge raw file. You get exactly the same file you started with when you remove th compression. It looks like they are just trying to take the edge off that heavy data bandwidth requirement.

    And I'm glad it is so. Who wants to lose precious resolution. Storage is cheap. I just bought a 4TB hard drive for about $150 with discounts.

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  • AndrewDeme
    replied
    Originally posted by John Brawley View Post
    Guys.

    DNG is an OPEN standard.

    Adobe don't own it anymore. Quoting the ADOBE manual doesn't mean something NEW isn't being developed within the DNG framework. BMD are part of the DNG working group and certainly are having a lot to say about where the standard is going.

    It's up to anyone to amend and extend. BMD have a history of doing this for standards...adopting new specs and for those specs to then become part of the standard. (hello 6G SDI ?)

    jb

    - and watch as we wait for Adobe to catch up on the format they invented and abandoned ;-)
    Honestly I think Adobe would be over the moon for others to sink their hard earned R&D dollars into an open standard that they can happily take advantage of.

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  • Andrew_HD
    replied
    Originally posted by jmad View Post
    I hope they really knock it out of the park with the compression. Red gets a lot of attention from their cameras but I think RedCode is really the heart of their products. If BMD can get close to RC with file size & quality it would really complete the puzzle.
    They won't go RED's JPEG2000 route- needs load of power to encode and I think it would be way to expensive (chip) for what BM is trying to do.
    It's also problematic in the post- Cineform in terms of performance/quality is miles ahead. There are other options: one of the simplest is to make 3:1 ProRes mode- just don't call it ProRes (to avoid problems with Apple). The beauty of this would be fact that it would still work with every app which supports ProRes

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  • faran saberi
    replied
    thank you

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  • refocusedmedia
    replied

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  • Frank Glencairn
    replied
    Would be easy with Cineform, but there must be some reason, why BM doesn't do that.

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  • jmad
    replied
    I hope they really knock it out of the park with the compression. Red gets a lot of attention from their cameras but I think RedCode is really the heart of their products. If BMD can get close to RC with file size & quality it would really complete the puzzle.

    Leave a comment:


  • John Brawley
    replied
    Guys.

    DNG is an OPEN standard.

    Adobe don't own it anymore. Quoting the ADOBE manual doesn't mean something NEW isn't being developed within the DNG framework. BMD are part of the DNG working group and certainly are having a lot to say about where the standard is going.

    It's up to anyone to amend and extend. BMD have a history of doing this for standards...adopting new specs and for those specs to then become part of the standard. (hello 6G SDI ?)

    jb

    - and watch as we wait for Adobe to catch up on the format they invented and abandoned ;-)

    Leave a comment:


  • Frank Glencairn
    replied
    The 8 bit JPEG part of CinemaDNG refers to some sort of proxie files, that can be generated on the fly.
    It has nothing to do with the actual material.

    Looking at the ratios, BM would probably apply some sort of lossless mild Huffman compression.

    Edit: Ah, Tzedekh was faster

    Leave a comment:


  • Tzedekh
    replied
    Originally posted by faran saberi View Post
    On both new cameras you will be getting compressed RAW files. DNG 1.4 is what it's called.
    Unless I'm mistaken, there's a lot of confusion about compressed CinemaDNG. It uses a variable-bit-rate, mathematically lossless, Huffman-type compression. As of the latest specification (v1.1, Sept. 2011), CinemaDNG doesn't yet support lossy compression, although it's under consideration.

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  • k0bayashi
    replied
    I really hope the compression is not motion-JPEG like. Looking forward to footage from JB soon

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  • AndrewDeme
    replied
    Originally posted by John Brawley View Post
    This is not what BMD are telling me. Both iterations of compressed RAW will be 12 BIT.

    JB.
    The comments about DNG being based on 8 bit JPEG are simply not true :-

    http://wwwimages.adobe.com/www.adobe...ec_1.4.0.0.pdf


    BitsPerSample
    Supported values are from 8 to 32 bits/sample. The depth must be the same for each sample if SamplesPerPixel is not equal to 1. If BitsPerSample is not equal to 8 or 16 or 32, then the bits must be packed into bytes using the TIFF default FillOrder of 1 (big-endian), even if the TIFF file itself uses little-endian byte order.


    Sure there are a myriad of options around how DNG is applied and used but can't see why BMD would bother going with the absolute minimum option in regard to bit depth.

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  • matthieu
    replied
    Hi John,I hop you will send us footage soon... to check the workflow...

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  • Ontheinterwebs
    replied
    Originally posted by John Brawley View Post
    This is not what BMD are telling me. Both iterations of compressed RAW will be 12 BIT.

    JB.
    Thanks John! Sounds like good news to me : )

    Looking forward to seeing some footage from the pocket cam soon, hint hint.

    Leave a comment:


  • John Brawley
    replied
    This is not what BMD are telling me. Both iterations of compressed RAW will be 12 BIT.

    JB.

    Leave a comment:

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