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Really nice, cheap, Veydra alternative

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  • Really nice, cheap, Veydra alternative

    http://www.pocketluts.com/meike-25mm...veydra-reborn/

    tldr: +/- $300, all metal build, 180º focus throw, super sharp, nice bokeh, little focus breathing.
    Pocketluts: Purpose-built LUTs for the Blackmagic Design Pocket Cinema Camera 4K
    Pocketluts Store

  • #2
    Looks kind of nice. And I believe you when you say that they are solid to the touch. But Building a metal case is probably the easy part.

    For me, they are too slow for the format and regardless of that, I wouldn't go with a lens with that amount of fringing—it jumps out of the frame under 'Distortion'.

    Then again, the thought of a set of 3 for $850 plus the P4K for $1295 makes me smile.

    Veydra would probably have had a better run if the P4K was already out. Is there no talk of a relaunch? Even so, I'm not sure those were all that great optically either?

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    • #3
      1. It's a personal decision, but I find the idea of a T2.2 cinema lens being "too slow" kind of amusing, and certainly telling of how the DSLR revolution has impacted low budget filmmakers' tastes. I'm certainly not trying to change your mind, but at that aperture, if the subject shifts back in forth in their chair, you lose focus.

      2. I do want to emphasize that I really forced a worst case scenario for the purple fringing. Unless your job is shooting chrome cars, I don't think it would show-up very often.

      3. Obviously, the price is the main attractor. They have a better build quality than lenses costing twice as much, and the next closest "cinema" lenses aren't really cinema lenses, are plastic, and have worse image problems. I think you have to go the whole way to the Xeen (10X as expensive) for a better cinema lens. If you don't care about cinema lens practicalities, then of course there are a lot of great lenses at about 2X the cost of the Meike.

      4. Veydra's partners are mired in a legal battle and haven't released new product in a very long time. If you can find a used M43 copy, they are climbing above the price of new lenses.
      Pocketluts: Purpose-built LUTs for the Blackmagic Design Pocket Cinema Camera 4K
      Pocketluts Store

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      • #4
        Thanks for the review!

        Seems like a really decent glass for the price. Might get it when they release a more complete set.

        BTW T2 is plenty fast for anyone using any form of additional lighting

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        • #5
          Originally posted by joe12south View Post
          1. It's a personal decision, but I find the idea of a T2.2 cinema lens being "too slow" kind of amusing, and certainly telling of how the DSLR revolution has impacted low budget filmmakers' tastes
          I don't say it in terms of it being a worthless lens. It's just that for each format there are different tiers. For full format, as an example, you get f1.4, f2.8 and f4 lens designs. This is obviously not all there is, but I think it's fair to say that they are clear tiers of design.

          I'm always thinking about the various formats in terms of equivalence. So for me, this lens is a f4 design (not splitting hairs here or going into T vs F stop) and I'd prefer if it was a 2.8 equivalent. There's a reason you get some lenses for MFT that are f0.95 that you don't see that many of in FF.

          Since price is not an issue for me (I just don't find it an interesting aspect of a product, it's not that I have unlimited money....) I'd be more interested in one or two tiers faster. The Voigtländer Noktons are all 0.95. That's probably two tiers faster?

          I'm not that familiar with MFT glass, so maybe 2.2 is a de facto standard that people are happy with? I just saw that the Veydras were also 2.2 (I remembered them being faster).

          Anyway, what exactly about it did you find amusing?

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          • #6
            Originally posted by joe12south View Post
            2. I do want to emphasize that I really forced a worst case scenario for the purple fringing. Unless your job is shooting chrome cars, I don't think it would show-up very often.
            I think it would show up everywhere: tree branches against the sky, edges of windows, around specular highlights.

            Originally posted by joe12south View Post
            3. Obviously, the price is the main attractor. If you don't care about cinema lens practicalities, then of course there are a lot of great lenses at about 2X the cost of the Meike.
            I'd like the price of a lens to be less than $1200, as I feel above that it's often a question of diminishing returns. I don't need cinema lenses. I prefer normal stills glass (the lenses I own myself) as I do at least as much photography as I do videography—and I don't need to buy dual setups when what I have works.

            I'd rather rent for the occasion if I feel I need cinema glass.

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            • #7
              Maybe "amusing" wasn't the best word...it's interesting to me to see how over the last decade we've raced to "needing" faster and faster lenses even as cameras' light gathering capabilities have exponentially increased. People are filling their bags with what not long ago would have been considered "specialty" lenses. Is it really practical or advisable to shoot moving pictures with a T0.95? If I can't keep the tip of an actress' nose and the back of her head in focus at the same time, shouldn't I stop down a bit? My goal is to capture a performance, to tell a story, not to fetishize a certain look. A T4 equivalent is probably where most people should be shooting most of the time. (I'm talking about filmmaking - not live events, etc.)

              I do agree that in a perfect world, I'd have a complete set of cinema lenses that were tack sharp at the FF equivalent of T2.8. That would be the most flexible. But those lenses don't exist at a price that an indie filmmaker can afford to own. I think the closest you could get would be a Xeen at around $2,500 a piece, and they're kind of soft wide open.

              Would I rent the Meike? I doubt it. If I have a rental budget, I'll go ahead and get a big boy lens. But I know that I'm not alone in wanting a personal kit that I have at hand all the time for grabbing a day of shooting.
              Pocketluts: Purpose-built LUTs for the Blackmagic Design Pocket Cinema Camera 4K
              Pocketluts Store

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              • #8
                If the 25mm has a 50mm field of view then it’s not a veydra knock off in the optics.

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                • #9
                  Sorry not into these Meike Mouse lenses
                  The bad CA ruins it for me.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by rze View Post
                    If the 25mm has a 50mm field of view then it’s not a veydra knock off in the optics.
                    I'm not sure what you mean. The lens is what the lens is. A 25mm is a 25mm. The equivalency comes from what sensor you pair it with. On a standard M43 mount, both the Veydra and the Meike will yield a FOV equivalent of a 50mm lens on a full frame sensor. The Pocket 4K and the GH5S have an oversized sensor, so they crop a bit less than 2X.
                    Pocketluts: Purpose-built LUTs for the Blackmagic Design Pocket Cinema Camera 4K
                    Pocketluts Store

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by AndreeOnline View Post
                      I think it would show up everywhere: tree branches against the sky, edges of windows, around specular highlights.
                      I'm gonna run out and test exactly this, as I'm curious myself.
                      Pocketluts: Purpose-built LUTs for the Blackmagic Design Pocket Cinema Camera 4K
                      Pocketluts Store

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by joe12south View Post
                        it's interesting to me to see how over the last decade we've raced to "needing" faster and faster lenses even as cameras' light gathering capabilities have exponentially increased. People are filling their bags with what not long ago would have been considered "specialty" lenses. Is it really practical or advisable to shoot moving pictures with a T0.95?
                        I don't feel quite the same way. Building my photo/video kit for FF and 1.3x video, I've centered around f1.4 for primes and f2.8 for zooms. To me, these are good quality, albeit "normal" lenses. The Nokton 0.95 would fall between these two levels at around f1.8 equivalence.

                        On my part, I scratch my head when people talk about shooting at ISOs higher than 3200. I rarely reach for ISO1600 and would never go above 6400. At 6400, in my mind, you are trying rescue something exceptional that only happens once.... =)


                        Originally posted by joe12south View Post
                        If I can't keep the tip of an actress' nose and the back of her head in focus at the same time, shouldn't I stop down a bit?
                        That sounds like a good idea. But having access to fast glass doesn't mean you shoot wide open all the time. It's often the fast glass that offers the best all around quality and offers the best flexibility (since you CAN open up). And when your focus distance is larger, opening up might be viable again.

                        Everything I say is naturally coloured by the fact that I'm based in FF, and I don't want several competing kits, but I am more interested in synergy and overlap.

                        But when a lens like this shows up: sturdy, cheap, purpose built... well, I got interested. But it would need to produce clean images. I'm more worried about the chromatic aberration than the T2.2.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by joe12south View Post
                          I'm gonna run out and test exactly this, as I'm curious myself.
                          Thanks!! Appreciate it!

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                          • #14
                            It's like somebody put lipstick on surveillance camera lenses.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by AndreeOnline View Post
                              Thanks!! Appreciate it!
                              I updated the original post with a window/tree branch shot.
                              Pocketluts: Purpose-built LUTs for the Blackmagic Design Pocket Cinema Camera 4K
                              Pocketluts Store

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