PDA

View Full Version : MFT vs EF



Danny1280
09-25-2012, 08:56 PM
Getting ready to place my order, and trying to decide between the two options.
Do these list of pros & cons seem correct?

If I go MFT, I can:
• More easily use my vintage, manual Nikkor primes
• Have more wide/fast choices (Voightlander f.095 series, etc)
• Still use the Tokina 11-16, but get the Nikon mount version
• NOT have any IS abilities, making handheld shooting more difficult
• Work nicely if I want to share lenses with a Nikon DSLR

If I go EF mount, I can:
• Get my camera sooner (hopefully)
• Have IS abilities, making handheld more viable (though not ideal)
• Easily interchange with a Canon, if I decide to get a Canon DSLR
• Have fewer fast/wide options, the Tokina 11-16 being my widest practical and cost efficient option.

Does that seem like a fair comparison?

Taikonaut
09-25-2012, 09:46 PM
Mostly correct. I would say IS handheld is just slight improvement, some don't like it as it is optimise for stills.
You can still use your Canon EF lens on a MFT with an adapter. You be surprise there are still those who believes you have to give up your Canon EF lens to go MFT, the only disadvantage here no iris control (which need to be set on a Canon body).

If you order today you won't necessary get your camera sooner by choosing EF. Personally I think for some who switched early to MFT might get theirs sooner than if they have not.

Danny1280
09-25-2012, 09:59 PM
thanks talkonaut. So that's interesting news to me...that the Canon IS is not such a huge help. This helps me makeup my mind...thanks.

The only downside to the Tokina 11-16 is that it's not useable on a full-frame dlsr..right?

yoclay
09-25-2012, 10:39 PM
You can use Canon lenses on the MFT mount and have iris control. Just not the iris in the lens. There are many inexpensive adapters for EF which include an iris in them.
To date, IS is still not even implemented in the camera, so who knows when that will happen.
Further I am not sure choosing EF will get you it any sooner. MFT is supposed to be shipping in December, and that may be earlier than for those who have back-ordered EF mounts.

The Tokina 11-16 is designed for ASP-C cameras (1.6x factor relative to full frame), however at 16mm it will cover a full frame sensor.

Liam
09-25-2012, 10:42 PM
Further I am not sure choosing EF will get you it any sooner. MFT is supposed to be shipping in December, and that may be earlier than for those who have back-ordered EF mounts.

Make's me wonder if the part(s) they are waiting for are for EF specific cameras, because it could become a reality that the MFT will be sent out first if that's the case?

yoclay
09-25-2012, 10:57 PM
Make's me wonder if the part(s) they are waiting for are for EF specific cameras, because it could become a reality that the MFT will be sent out first if that's the case?


To be honest, I think speculation is fruitless at this point.
It will ship when it ships.
In the meantime I try to focus on what I can do and use for today.
Personally, I still think my 5D Mark III does a great job.
If I need something more elaborate I can always rent.

Jason M.
09-25-2012, 11:08 PM
Make's me wonder if the part(s) they are waiting for are for EF specific cameras, because it could become a reality that the MFT will be sent out first if that's the case?

I doubt that's the case, and I'd be willing to bet that many people who ordered their EF mount version first will still get it before the MFT people. Pretty sure BlackMagic is going to try to get through some of the EF backlog before ramping up production on the MFT.

If it is the case, though, I'm cool with it, being that I switched my EF order to MFT.

Barry Green
09-25-2012, 11:34 PM
Make's me wonder if the part(s) they are waiting for are for EF specific cameras, because it could become a reality that the MFT will be sent out first if that's the case?

They are not. Grant Petty gave an update, it was sensors that was the holdup. That would be the same for both versions.

Barry Green
09-25-2012, 11:36 PM
If I go MFT, I can:
• More easily use my vintage, manual Nikkor primes

This part is about the only one I'd point out as being incorrect. You can use manual Nikon lenses on a Canon-mount camera. I mean, if you want to say it's easier on the MFT, I guess that's technically accurate, in that you can put one mft->Nikon adapter on the camera and then use your lenses as-is, while such a workflow isn't all that convenient with Canon; the adapters are so small that it's more practical to put a Canon adapter on each lens. But I guess the point is, you could definitely use the Nikon lenses on both bodies.

Gwangjuboy
09-25-2012, 11:44 PM
I think stabilization on lenses is underrated. I will wait till I can compare the footage of an EF lens with IS compared with wides on the MFT before I decide which camera to buy.

Kholi
09-26-2012, 12:33 AM
If I knew that I would get a dumb mount MFT camera the same time as an EF camera, without a doubt I would choose the dumb mount MFT camera.

If by some miracle, by the time they ship, you actually have the option, that's what I'll do.

morgan_moore
09-26-2012, 01:17 AM
The $30 iris canon adapters dont work.
Im sure proper electronic adapters are availabel for Canon to MTF (maybe without IS) Redrock for example
Nikon non G certainly work on Canon and maybe G too.

As for IS its useuful for a handheld lockoff but pretty strange if you have the cheek to want to pan or tilt while rolling

MFT all the way!

S

yoclay
09-26-2012, 02:34 AM
The $30 iris canon adapters dont work.


S
That's news to me.

They work fine on my gh2.
i can close down and open up.
Change exposure and DOF.
What is it exactly that doesn't work?
It's not rocket science.

morgan_moore
09-26-2012, 03:01 AM
Having the iris behind the lens just get in the way

Doesnt your stuff vignette like a baddun?

Mabe its a smaller chip thing?

S

Fabián Matas
09-26-2012, 04:31 AM
With the MFT you can use PL, for me this is the real deal.

metaljesus
09-26-2012, 05:33 AM
Personally I'm heavily invested in L series glass so I need the in-camera iris control. All my vintage glass at this point (a set of Leica R series primes) adapts to EF. Makes an easy choice for me.

Danny1280
09-26-2012, 06:22 AM
thanks talkonaut. So that's interesting news to me...that the Canon IS is not such a huge help. This helps me makeup my mind...thanks.

The only downside to the Tokina 11-16 is that it's not useable on a full-frame dlsr..right?

So I can use a Tokina 11-16 on a D800 on the wide end with no vignetting?

Brian@202020
09-26-2012, 07:25 AM
You can use Canon lenses on the MFT mount and have iris control. Just not the iris in the lens...

These adapters with a built in irises are garbage. As the f-stop gets higher and the DoF gets greater the blade start to appear in the image. They vignette at higher f-stops because the iris blades are not at the optimal place on the lens. Also I'd note you CAN use a MFT to EF adapter the utilizes the lenses own iris. The Redrock Live Lens MFT (http://store.redrockmicro.com/livelensmft) will work flawlessly.


...The Tokina 11-16 is designed for ASP-C cameras (1.6x factor relative to full frame), however at 16mm it will cover a full frame sensor.

I'd also note that that most new Nikon cameras automatically crop the sensor to accommodate these 1.6 crop lenses, so they can still be used on full frame camera's, even at 11mm. I don't think the Canon's do this, but I'm not 100% on that.

senorcitizen
09-26-2012, 09:37 AM
The Redrock costs as much as a decent stills lens...

Humor me:
What about cheap Hong Kong ebay adaptors for Nikkors that say they can control the lens's iris? Is that more likely to work than a Canon adaptor (assuming you haven't already bought Canon lenses, which I haven't) because with the Nikon mount it's a mechanical trigger to control aperture rather than an electronic contact?

randyman
09-26-2012, 10:08 AM
I've got a suite of old Nikon/Nikkor primes that I've been using on my 7D with simple adapters. I love the way they look. Just wanted to let you know they go great with the EF mount.

CineMac
09-26-2012, 11:51 AM
I concur with randyman... but if you get them from ebay via China, order 'em asap. My adapters took 2.5 weeks to arrive.

imdjay
09-26-2012, 01:26 PM
this needs to be cleared up about adapters and iris control, as im seeing some confusion here:

nikon lenses CAN use the inexpensive adapters to control iris

canon lenses can NOT use inexpensive adapters to control iris

hence you cannot use a EF lens on the MFT mount and get iris control without RRM livelens, birger, or other expensive electronic addition

nikon lenses have a small lever within the mount that allows mechanical iris override, canons do not. no way around it. if you want to control a canon's iris, it's either the EF BMC, or a $500+ adapter. no ifs ands or buts

CineMac
09-26-2012, 01:59 PM
Thanks imdjay.

Yes, I should also clarify. I have manual Nikkor Ai's. The adapters I got were simple Nikon F to Canon EF mount adapters with no electronics.

yoclay
09-26-2012, 02:41 PM
this needs to be cleared up about adapters and iris control, as im seeing some confusion here:

nikon lenses CAN use the inexpensive adapters to control iris

canon lenses can NOT use inexpensive adapters to control iris

hence you cannot use a EF lens on the MFT mount and get iris control without RRM livelens, birger, or other expensive electronic addition

nikon lenses have a small lever within the mount that allows mechanical iris override, canons do not. no way around it. if you want to control a canon's iris, it's either the EF BMC, or a $500+ adapter. no ifs ands or buts

No if's ands or but's? Categorique?

My goodness what a lot of experts we have here.

Just for your information, you are wrong.
I am sitting here with a Canon 35/1.4 and an iris adapter on a GH2. NO VIGNETTING.
Same thing for a 50mm.

Want me to prove it?
Here you go - Canon 35/1.4 on GH2 (6400 ASA):

1/1600 sec Iris fully closed down
1220

1/15 sec Iris fully open
1221


Just so you know:
Where people mostly experience vignetting with Canon lenses and these iris adapters, is with Zooms, not primes.
Your mileage may vary.

imdjay
09-26-2012, 03:03 PM
No if's ands or but's? Categorique?

My goodness what a lot of experts we have here.

Just for your information, you are wrong.
I am sitting here with a Canon 35/1.4 and an iris adapter on a GH2. NO VIGNETTING.
Same thing for a 50mm.

Want me to prove it?
Here you go - Canon 35/1.4 on GH2 (6400 ASA):

1/1600 sec Iris fully closed down
1220

1/15 sec Iris fully open
1221


Just so you know:
Where people mostly experience vignetting with Canon lenses and these iris adapters, is with Zooms, not primes.
Your mileage may vary.

don't be so quick to be rude... you're either confused and/or just not being specific, i can only assume from your description that you're referring to a kipon style adapter which "adds" an iris, it does not control the proper iris in the lens. i specifically referred to controlling the iris, not adding one with one of those adapters. it's this lack of being specific about what you're referring to that confuses people. brevity and clarity can coexist.

yoclay
09-26-2012, 03:10 PM
don't be so quick to be rude... you're either confused and/or just not being specific, i can only assume from your description that you're referring to a kipon style adapter which "adds" an iris, it does not control the proper iris in the lens. i specifically referred to controlling the iris, not adding one with one of those adapters. it's this lack of being specific about what you're referring to that confuses people. brevity and clarity can coexist.

To be brief, you stated that:


canon lenses can NOT use inexpensive adapters to control iris

The fact is that you can control iris, just not the one in the lens.
Which is what I already stated previous to your post and for which several folks have stated was impossible without vignetting.

So no if's and's or but's is definitely far too categorique.

Gabriel De Bourg
09-26-2012, 03:16 PM
The fact is that you can control iris, just not the one in the lens.

Again meaning, you can't control the iris. What you do is adding a secondary iris. I've used a Kipon adapter. Worked OK sometimes and other times it was just awful. It's is what it is - a workaround. It's not an ideal solution in the long run. Nikon G on the other hand has a mechanical lever, so there you DO control the iris in the lens. Which is what we mean by controlling the iris.